ITH Poker Forum

[BobBarker]

A lot of limit charts are similair but I find a few differences Im still confused about? You can raise AJ offsuit and KQ offsuit or even 88+ UTG but cant call a raise with these hands and sometimes the chart says if your in late position you can call or three bet does this make any sense? It says you can limp hands like 88 or 99 and qj suited or kj suited should you just raise these hands or not play them in early position?

[nsidestrate]

You can raise AJ offsuit and KQ offsuit or even 88+ UTG but cant call a raise with these hands

This makes perfect sense in that you almost always want a stronger hand to call than to raise yourself. However, I think raising KQ offsuit is likely a poor decision from UTG. At most tables, I wouldn't even open KQs. If you think about it, the logic for raising but not calling AJ is easy to see. If you raise AJ, AQ might fold and if it doesn't it will re-raise you and you know that you have to proceed with caution. If no one re-raises you, you figure to have the best Ace. However, if someone raises in front of you and you call them, you have no idea where you stand if you hit an Ace. In fact, the odds are quite good that you are dominated.

and sometimes the chart says if your in late position you can call or three bet does this make any sense?

This does make sense. In general if you are against one other player it is almost always best to three bet anything you intend to play (there are exceptions, but that's a pretty good rule of thumb). If there are multiple people in the pot, you might want to just call and play the hand in position.

It says you can limp hands like 88 or 99 and qj suited or kj suited should you just raise these hands or not play them in early position?

Those are all hands I'd generally ditch in early position. If I were to play them and was the first to enter the pot, I'd raise. 99/88 would be hands I'd consider way more often than QJs/KJs, which are pretty crappy hands to be playing out of position. Even from middle position those hands aren't great.

[BobBarker]

Online is usually ten handed the casino that is close to me is 9 handed limit. What is a good opening raising range for and average table UTG, Middle, Late, and a reraising range with position? Ive seen the chart say you can 3 bet AQ suited but not AQ off isnt the same hand? When are you throwing AJ and KQ offsuit or suited in the mix, I dont really like it UTG? Are you floating to the turn with AK if you miss? You never know what there raise or check raise means in poker? What are you isolating one limper or multiple limpers with?

[nsidestrate]

Online is usually ten handed the casino that is close to me is 9 handed limit. What is a good opening raising range for and average table UTG, Middle, Late, and a reraising range with position?

As you get more experienced, you won't really want to follow a rigid standard. However, I'd say that Matthew's chart is probably as good as any.

Ive seen the chart say you can 3 bet AQ suited but not AQ off isnt the same hand?

The hands are obviously close in value, but any suited hand is better than the same offsuit hand.

When are you throwing AJ and KQ offsuit or suited in the mix, I dont really like it UTG?

You are probably never making a mistake to throw away more hands UTG.

Are you floating to the turn with AK if you miss? You never know what there raise or check raise means in poker?

This is probably too complex of a question to address in general terms. I'd suggest posting some specific hands and we can comment on it.

What are you isolating one limper or multiple limpers with?

This depends on a number of factors. If the limper plays bad enough, I'm likely to reraise with a much wider range than if he is good. Sometimes you want to re-raise with particular hands to thin the field. Matthew's charts try to address some of these issues.

[BobBarker]

The Chart says to limp kq suited UTG? Is just calling with KQ off middle position a good idea first one in? It says to call a raise with AJ suited but not AJ? Are you slowplaying much in limit or are you playing aggressive why? You think if theres a limper your just calling with 1010 or raising I dont like limping or calling really in limit? If someone follows this chart and only reraises with QQ KK AA and AK and calls with JJ and AQ shouldnt it all be the same action?

[nsidestrate]

The Chart says to limp kq suited UTG?

That's pretty much an edge case. The old chart said to fold it. Miller says to raise. The advanced section calls it a borderline raise/re-raise/fold. Personally, I'd either raise or fold. Its probably not much different which option you choose.

Is just calling with KQ off middle position a good idea first one in?

Again an edge case. The advanced section says you can open-raise or raise one limper. I'd play it that way. The chart is designed to keep beginners out of trouble.

It says to call a raise with AJ suited but not AJ?

That is pretty standard in any limit text.

Are you slowplaying much in limit or are you playing aggressive why? You think if theres a limper your just calling with 1010 or raising I dont like limping or calling really in limit?

If you never open-limped, always open-raised, you'd be in fine company. Many limit players would never open-limp. However, calling often makes sense instead of re-raising.

If someone follows this chart and only reraises with QQ KK AA and AK and calls with JJ and AQ shouldnt it all be the same action?

In late position, you should be re-raising much wider than that and the chart reflects that. I show re-raises for 99+, AJs+, AQ. The chart shows you choosing re-raise against one raiser and calling if a number of people have called the raise. Again, we are in fine detail stuff here, but I tend to re-raise more loosely depending on how much I think the raiser is playing. If a tight player raises UTG, I'm folding more. If a loose player raises from the CO, I'm 3 betting a ton more. It all depends on the situation.

[BobBarker]

What seperates a good limit player versus a great limit player? You dont like three betting at all? Are you going to the river unimproved with 99? Should Kq suited be raised first in and not call a raise or reraise with? Value betting and raising preflop and postflop vs. slowplaying?

[nsidestrate]

What seperates a good limit player versus a great limit player?

Anyone better then me is great. The difference between good and great players is pretty small. An average player probably can't tell the difference. I'd say that a good player makes few if any outright mistakes. A great player takes every edge he can find, no matter how small.

You dont like three betting at all?

Not sure where you got that idea. I three bet more than most.

Are you going to the river unimproved with 99?

Sometimes. You probably should start posting specific hands instead of asking general questions like this. Its very hard to learn anything useful from this sort of question.

Should Kq suited be raised first in and not call a raise or reraise with?

That's not a bad rule. There are plenty of situations where I'd re-raise it, though. For instance in the small blind against a Button raise, I'm 3 betting most every time.

Value betting and raising preflop and postflop vs. slowplaying?

In about 90% of the situations you will encounter in limit poker, slowplaying is a bad idea.

[BobBarker]

Say someone raises in middle position you have 99 in middle position or AJ suited are you folding because your not in late position? Why are there small differences in each hand chart? Would you rather 3 bet a raiser with position or in the blinds or would you just call the raise from the blinds? Are you checking the missed flush out of position on the river to induce bluffs?

[nsidestrate]

Say someone raises in middle position you have 99 in middle position or AJ suited are you folding because your not in late position?

It depends on a lot of factors. Mostly based on how loose and bad I think the raiser is. I'd try to isolate a looser or weaker play more often. The reason you are more comfortable reraising in late position is that you don't have as many people behind you who might 4 bet.

Why are there small differences in each hand chart?

Those are the borderline cases. You will learn that it doesn't really make all that much difference.

Would you rather 3 bet a raiser with position or in the blinds or would you just call the raise from the blinds?

Generally from the small blind, I'd 3 bet almost every time unless I really thought the BB was terrible. Once in a while I experiment will just calling with hands like JTs, but usually I'd 3 bet. From the big blind, I almost always just call.

Are you checking the missed flush out of position on the river to induce bluffs?

I don't understand this question. If I missed the flush, I'm not really hoping to induce bluffs.

[BobBarker]

Here some examples from memory dont have the exact history? Players limps Ax spades utg another player calls I raise with KK board is good Ks 9s 6h. Player with Ax bets player b calls, would you raise here or wait till turn without a spade?

Say I have AQ board is Ah 10h 7d, I raise preflop get one caller C bet flop, bet the turn is 7c. River blanks 9c do you check to induce a missed flush or bet for value? Would you check raise AK here on the river or just bet?

Later position you dont get four bet as much unless the original raiser or blinds do so. Are you folding 99 preflop to a raise and no callers? There are a few small differences but its annoying when your not sure what to do with the hand then your doubting yourself...which leads to hesitation and failure? Is AJ suited just as strong as AJ offsuit or is there that much of a difference to 3 bet suited and fold offsuit?

[nsidestrate]

Here some examples from memory dont have the exact history? Players limps Ax spades utg another player calls I raise with KK board is good Ks 9s 6h. Player with Ax bets player b calls, would you raise here or wait till turn without a spade?

I used to say a long time ago that the best strategy with a set is to mash the bet/raise button every chance you get. Its still pretty good advice. You should absolutely bomb away here.

Say I have AQ board is Ah 10h 7d, I raise preflop get one caller C bet flop, bet the turn is 7c. River blanks 9c do you check to induce a missed flush or bet for value? Would you check raise AK here on the river or just bet?

In general, I'd bet here. I'd expect to see weaker Aces more often than missed flushes. If the board was queen high, I'd be more inclined to check to induce the bluff against the right players.

Later position you dont get four bet as much unless the original raiser or blinds do so. Are you folding 99 preflop to a raise and no callers? There are a few small differences but its annoying when your not sure what to do with the hand then your doubting yourself...which leads to hesitation and failure? Is AJ suited just as strong as AJ offsuit or is there that much of a difference to 3 bet suited and fold offsuit?

It all depends. If the raise was from middle position or late position, I'd 3 bet 99 for certain. Against a tight early position raiser, I could fold. I know you don't think so right now, but you could just pick any one of the popular charts and follow it and be fine. If you struggle, its because of post-flop mistakes instead of small decisions pre-flop. If you follow any reasonable starting chart, you'll be fine.

There isn't that much difference between AJs and AJ, but the line has be drawn somewhere. Wherever you draw it, there is a hand on one side that is very close to a hand on the other side.

[BobBarker]

It seems like the ace flops a lot of the time when you have kq and kj or even kk qq jj 10 10? You think its a winning play to bet 99 or call with it against one opponent on any board in the long run to the river except A K 5 or A Q 6? Its like the situation where they have QQ and you have KK and the board is A 9 2 and maybe you have first action and you bet and they raise? It seems like in limit your always down a couple big blinds before you even get a winning hand than if you let that effect they way your playing than your really done for? Would you rather bet Ak on a Q J 2 board or have a limper on the button sb raises you reraise button calls sb caps I call button calls board is Q J 6 sb bets are you folding flop or turn? One mistake or two mistakes calling or betting to the river seems to crush you, If you play to tight you get blinded out if you play to loose you get everything stolen from you?

[nsidestrate]

I'm sorry, but I don't have the energy to try to pick the questions out of that paragraph today. How about if you try to pick one or two at a time?

[BobBarker]

Alright if you just sit down and a table and post next to dealer button and someone raises whats the weakest pair you would reraise him with and whats the weakest Ace hand you would reraise him with?