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Thread: Improving W$WSF in PokerTracker

  1. #1
    Success2be's Avatar
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    Improving W$WSF in PokerTracker

    I only have about 1200 hands imported. My stats are VP$IP = 19.42% across .50/1, 1/2, 2/4, and 3/6 (dropped from 3/6, been on a losing streak). W$WSF = 21.67%. Amount won = (178.63). BB/100 = (2.23). W$SD = 51.72%. PFR = 3.82%.

    I'm trying to get the W$WSF to around 35% as stated in the how-to beginner articles for PokerTracker on ITH. I know that when I'm the last to act on the flop and didn't hit, I check most of the time. How often should I try to steal as in betting when I'm last to act and everyone else checks. I re-read Matthew's chapter on flop with overcards and he indicated its possible to steal with 1 to 2 people on the flop.
    Life pushes all of us around. Some give up. Othes fight. A few learn the lesson and move on. They welcome life pushing them around. To these few people, it means they need and want to learn something. Most quit, and a few like you fight -Rich Dad

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    Maybe try to get your PFR higher, around 7%. Then in the situation you are talking about your opponents will be more willing to release a hand to you when you bet from last position after everyone checking on the flop.

    It is surprising what pre-flop aggression can do for your hand in the later rounds of play. I am not advocating raising here with junk. But in your example you say you are in late position and it has been checked to you on the flop. Lets say that the pre-flop betting came to you as call, call, call (you get the idea). Then if you have a good enough hand to call, you may be better off raising. You may buy the button and drive out the blinds. Chances are you have a better hand than the limpers or they would have entered with a raise themselves. Make the blind money, dead money and your hand will play alot easier on the flop and later.

    Put your opponents on defense.

  4. #3
    Success2be's Avatar
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    Thanks.

    I have only been raising preflop with premium hands of AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AK, AQs. I have to fight against my superego always reminding me of my raises not hitting or my premium top pair getting out drawn.
    Life pushes all of us around. Some give up. Othes fight. A few learn the lesson and move on. They welcome life pushing them around. To these few people, it means they need and want to learn something. Most quit, and a few like you fight -Rich Dad

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    Gamblor's Avatar
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    I think in the limits that you are playing, a 35% W$WSF might be a little out of reach. I've got around 8000 hands in at 2/4. On average, 38.8% see the flop and with an average of 9.2 players. If all of the cards even out, each person should win about 28% of the time.

    By entering pots with above average holdings, the number should be a little higher than that. But, you will be entering pots from the blinds with some below average hands as well. In late position, you will likely be seeing the flop with some hands that need a lot of help when there are a lot of callers. Small and medium pairs and suited connectors won't win their share of pots, but they will win their share of money.

    My W$WSF is 27%. I'm sure its possible to improve this number, but I'm happy with it. I do play pretty straightforward, and don't bluff a lot in LP. One time where I do like to bluff is in the blinds when the flop is checked around. Doesn't happen very often, but every now and again I drag in an extra pot.
    "You can observe a lot just by watching." - Yogi Berra

  6. #5
    Senior Member cybrarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gamblor
    My W$WSF is 27%. I'm sure its possible to improve this number, but I'm happy with it.
    Mine is nearer that than 35%, too. I was looking at 35% and thinking that it's just way too optomistic at the low limits. I know there are folks here who will have a W$WSF% of around 32-35%, but you don't need to be up that high to be profitable.

    I'm probably hovering around 29%, with most of my hand histories in 2/4 and 3/6, and I'm running at just over 2BB/100 hands.

    If you enter pots more selectively you might find it possible to win more often when you do enter a hand. Without knowing anything about the tables you've played at, or any other factors in your play, it looks as though you're limping into a few pots with hands you sometimes find it hard to get away from (suited cards giving you top pair/weak kicker for example.)
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  7. #6
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    I'm about 28% on paradise and party where I'm winning and around 24% at Corals where I'm a little down (get big up's and down's there). I'm still trying to get my head round all the stats at pokertracker and have found these posts very helpful

  8. #7
    Success,
    Your flop and showdown percentages look pretty good. However based on your preflop rasise % and % won when seeing the flop, I would say you are playing too tight. If you are hitting 50% of your showdowns, and your winning % when seeing the flop is only 21%, then you must be low in your winning % of flops that don't go to showdown. What % of your flop hands make it to showdown? If you are throwing too much away after the flop, your showdown % will look good because you are only going to showdown with the nuts or close, but your flop winning % will be low. Out of my flop hands, 38%-42% see a showdown. Just a thought, hope that makes sense. Good luck.

  9. #8

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    Now at a little over 900 hands, my W$WSF is at 32.60, PFR is 6.65, W$ASD is 55.17, with a 36.36% that went to SD. What other things do I want to really look for in the software as I build up my hands. My BB/100 is currently at 14.96 which I know is very high and will come down over time.

  10. #9
    MX,
    Your numbers started out very much like mine. For starters, when they do come down, be aware of what got you there and keep doing it. When my numbers started to come back to reality, I had a few sessions where I about took a bat to my computer. As a result I lost about 25% of what I had built (tilt). You really need to build up a bigger database before you can get a clear idea of your patterns, but I would keep an eye on what hands in different positions are working for you. Use the filters and see how you play different types of hands. How aggressive are you, do you ever check-raise, what hands did you lose with at showdown. IMHO, to improve with Pokertracker, you really need to target an area and then review some hands that you played. Overall stats are good for finding a starting point or identifying major leaks, but they will vary depending on the type of table you are against. Try using the session notes to describe the type of game you were in and what type of game you were trying to play at that time. Its a pretty anal process. Good luck.

  11. #10

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    Rasputin, thanks for the reply. Now that I have hit a level to where I am wanting to analyze my play, I am really not sure how to use the program to do that. As I become more familiar with it, I am sure that will become apparent, but I am still unsure at this point. The basics at this point to me are seeing how different hands hold up and seeing how well I am doing overall (bb/100).

  12. #11
    Bugsbunny's Avatar
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    The biggest thing you want to do to start is get your PFR number higher. That will effect everything else so re-evaluate after you've done that for a while.

    When I play full ring my PFR tends to be at about 11%. At 6 max it runs 16%.

    7% isn't bad, but it can be better. Shoot for 9-10%. Higher PFR's will translate into a higher won when saw flop number, as long as you maintain the aggression (not blindly, of course). Anything under 5-6% is way too low.
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  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bugsbunny
    The biggest thing you want to do to start is get your PFR number higher. That will effect everything else so re-evaluate after you've done that for a while.

    When I play full ring my PFR tends to be at about 11%. At 6 max it runs 16%.

    7% isn't bad, but it can be better. Shoot for 9-10%. Higher PFR's will translate into a higher won when saw flop number, as long as you maintain the aggression (not blindly, of course). Anything under 5-6% is way too low.
    My PFR is definitely something I am not comfortable with at this point. Not that I don't raise it, but not sure about how strong the hand needs to be from different positions. I am awaiting Matthew's book to "learn" this aspect of my game. Hopefully it will turn into larger pots for me!

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