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Thread: How do you know how good you are?

  1. #1
    Senior Member jeffnc's Avatar
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    How do you know how good you are?

    If you look at the math, you can't tell if you should be ahead with much certainty until about 1400 hours of play. And that's if you're a full big bet ahead per hour in skill. What if you're a half BB per hour? Aside from hiring a professional to work with you and tell you your level, how would you have any ide of knowing where you stand? It occurs to me I really have no way of knowing.

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  4. #3
    Senior Member cybrarian's Avatar
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    Like Martek says, if you beat the game over a reasonable period, then you're probably a good player at that game.

    The longer period you can be a consistently winning player for the more right you would be to consider yourself a good player. However, being able to spot the difference between bad beats and bad play, and being able to spot weaknesses and strengths in your opponents contribute as well.

    I don't know exactly what counts as a meaningful length of time / number of hands played. Why 1400 in particular? - I'd be interested to know the maths on that one.
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  5. #4
    pilchard's Avatar
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    I consider you to be a good player cyb, far better than that joker Rkopa I was watching play at your table the other day

    You know when you are a good player when you know WHY you are winning and WHY you are losing. Be careful, though I thought for the first 4 months of playing poker that I was losing because of bad beats. I was (on occasions) but a lot of the time I was making mistakes. In general, my play stank.

    In my opinion a good poker player does or has 4 things; intelligence, the right personality, studying and experience.

    Intelligence does not mean being good exams or having great general knowledge. It just means having a bit of common sense and an ability to learn.

    Personality is important. You need to be laid back. You cannot let the ups and downs of the game frustrate you otherwise you will make mistakes and lose money.

    Studying is crucial. You can try and pick up the game without reading but I don't think you will have much success. You need to read everything and anything and question everything you read.

    Experience. You have to get the hours in to become a good player. You can be intelligent, be laid back and do all the reading you can but it means nothing if you haven't spent the hours at the tables.
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  6. #5
    The 1400 hours is from Matthew's book and is statistical based on the standard deviation of actual results of a good player.

    Let me extrapolate a bit on Matthew's chapter. (Matthew do you agree with this extrapolation?)

    Imagine a bell shaped curve with 1BB being at the center. Not until 1400 hours does the lower point of the bell shape curve equal zero. But at 1400 hours you still might not know if you are a profitable player. If you are a 1 BB per hour player your expectation is 0BB to 2BB with 1BB being at the middle of the curve. But if you are a 0BB player your expectation after 1400 hours is -1BB to 1BB with 0BB being the centre of the curve and if you are a 2BB per hour player your expectation after 1400 hours is 1BB to 3BB with 2BB being the centre of the curve.

    So if after 1400 hours your results are 1BB, where do you really stand? Well you'd know you are a breakeven player or better.

    fep
    Sure am glad my government knows what is best for me..., and if I disagree, well then, Iíll just have to go to jail for a while and think about it.

  7. #6
    I think that if you haven't put in the hours, you can still determine your ballpark level of play through self-testing. The hand examples on this site are a great indication (do you quickly know what is the correct thing to do?), the hand examples in Matthew's and Ciaffone/Brier's books, and the many hand examples (mostly Brier) in the CardPlayer archives.

    I don't think I would rate myself as good without being able to nail a good % of them, and wouldn't be very good if I couldn't nail a lot of them on a 30 sec timer.

    Just my opinion!

    D

  8. #7
    Senior Member cybrarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fep
    Imagine a bell shaped curve with 1BB being at the center. Not until 1400 hours does the lower point of the bell shape curve equal zero.
    Do I detect the terms standard deviation and interquartile means shuffling about in the vicinity of this topic?

    It's a fair few hours, though, so until then I'll just have to trust my incredible intelligence and personality to see me through...
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